Debabrata Zone+Geet — English Transcript
Do you remember the first song you learnt?
Yes, I do. The first song I learnt was one written by Rabindranath.
Well, I did not have any formal training. Like any Bengali kid, I came to know about Rabindrasangeet through very ordinary things. Something like, when we used to play Antakshari, the one who got the first turn would always start with “Momo Chitte Niti Nritye”. That was the rule. You don’t have to think any further. But when I grew up and started listening to Rabindrasangeet on my own, I had this realization that almost all of the Rabindrasangeet tend to get boring after a point. It was confusing. I could see a lot of people around me who loved listening to Rabindrasangeet which I could never get myself to like. The questions that naturally came up — Am I the one to blame? Was it due to the fact that I could not understand the meaning that I was unable to appreciate?
I get it. I did not face such problems. Honestly though, during the learning years, I never cared to understand the meaning behind the words. I sung what I was taught. But yes, while I was being taught Rabindrsangeet, it was always stressed on how these songs were above ordinary. These were special. Something grand. I remember things from my childhood. Once my uncle had brought a Rabindrasangeet cassette to our place. It was to be played on the tape recorder. He said that the songs in the cassette were sung by a very famous artist, Debabrata Biswas. I kept listening to the songs as they were being played. I had listened to Rabindrasangeet before and had an idea about how they were meant to sound. The songs being played sounded very different and honestly, I did not quite like them. Few years from that incident, when I was studying in eight or ninth standard, there was one Bengali movie being telecasted on Doordarshan. I wasn’t even paying attention. But the movie had a sequence with the song, “Je Raate Mor Duwarguli Bhanglo Jhore”, which I really liked, the very first time I heard it. Later, when I started searching for the singer who had sung that particular song, I found it was the same Debabrata Biswas!
This is a coincidence. I had first seen the movie while I was in college and not in school. It was then that I found that very same sequence as something brilliant. But, it is also true that the liking I had, was not solely due to Debabrata Biswas’s singing. I felt the entire sequence to be something beyond ordinary.
True! This is something I realized way later in my life. This is a matter of combination and that too, a brilliant one! If you can recall, “Komol Gandhar” movie had that song “Akash Bhora Surjo Tara”. In that sequence too, Debarata Biswas was the singer and Anil Chatterjee was the actor. That scene of walking barefoot on the hilly slopes accompanied by a song like this!
Yes. I guess it was you who made me listen to the interview, “Nijer Mukhe Nijer Kotha”? Didn’t you find that while looking for a song?
Yes! That interview was a whole different thing. To be honest, it was very new to me, the way in which a person can think and articulate about singing and its related appreciation, all in one interview. If you can remember, he mentioned two human aspects— intellect and emotion. Intellect is something which you can improve by working hard on it and through exposure. However, emotion is something very original. This is something you will not be able to modify. Now, different people have different set of emotions. So, even when these different set of people consume the same thing, their reactions naturally differ.
There was also this thing about singing and cricket! Debabrata Biswas was able to relate these two very different things. He said — I am the bowler and my audience are the batsmen facing me with their emotion and intellect as the stumps behind them. Now, I am constantly trying to bowl things like bumper or bouncer, with the only intention of having them clean bowled. The idea is to affect the intellect and the emotion of the audience through singing. Now, we know how in cricket, all batsmen do not get out by the same type of delivery and also, few even remain unbeaten at the end of the innings. That is where Debabrata Biswas referred to when he said that similarly, it is impossible to move everyone by singing.
Now that you have been talking about cricket, what if a rule is made to prevent you from bowling at all? Let me explain. We know that songs written by Rabindranath is not bound by any copyright now. But there was a time when it was. How was the process? Let’s say, you would like to record a song created by Rabindranath. First, you would need to get a permission from Visvabharati Music Board on whether you can record the particular song or not. Let’s assume that they did give the permission and you recorded the song. Next, you would have to get your recording finally approved by the music board and only after that your recording would be released. Even with this rule in place, Debabrata Biswas had already sung and even released few records of songs written by Rabindranath. However, after a certain point the music board started coming up with different types of objections. What were these objections like? For some songs, it was that the accompanying music was inappropriate. For others, there were issues with the notation while some of the songs were even branded as “awfully melodramatic”. Initially when Debabrata Biswas started sending out letters enquiring about the exact concerns, some of the songs were ultimately approved through discussions. However, the objections kept coming.
Strange! Because at the same time, other artists were getting approvals.
Exactly! That is the issue I had been talking about. At this point in time, Debabrata Biswas decided to stop recording songs by Rabindranath.
Yes. Even if they could stop his recordings, they couldn’t stop his singing.
He did not stop recording at the very first objection. Once, the music board sent across a list of instruments. It mandated that if anybody wanted to record songs by Rabindranath, they must only use instruments from that list without any exceptions. There were two justifications that they gave to prohibit the usage of instruments outside the list. Firstly, it would hurt the sentiments of the songs. Secondly and more importantly, if anyone uses western instruments, that would be the worst case scenario!
Let’s say, there was a Scottish song that Rabindranath heard and liked and eventually made a Bengali version of. Now the original composition being Scottish, it must have been composed using a western instrument? Now, if I would have tried to record the original composition in this Bengali version by Rabindranath, using the same/original instrument, I would have surely faced objections!
This is ludicrous! Do you really mean to stop people from mixing eastern with western? Is that even possible? It was just the other day that I found harmonium being used in an English song! It sounded good to my ears!
That album by Philip Glass and Ravishankar! The way the entire album had been made and specially the very last song! Ravishankar can be heard singing only to be followed by someone playing violin! You can also consider the music used in “Charulata”. Satyajit Ray said, it was true that the song was a Scottish one recreated by Rabindranath in Bengali. However, when it came to using it in his film, he chose western instruments. The point he made was very important — he felt it was needed and that was all that mattered.
It is pretty clear that these circulars had nothing else to do other than stopping someone from recording. In case the instrument list is not enough, they will say that the spirit of the song is incorrect and then reject it.
Isn’t the judgement regarding the spirit of a song dependent solely upon the members at the top of the board? It is impossible to be certain if their judgement exactly matched Rabindranath’s.
That is exactly my point!
Take for instance, “Sokhi Bhabona Kahare Bole”. We have been listening to this song in the same way, over and over again since childhood. It immediately strikes as a song someone sings after a botched relationship. We have even seen singers and listeners crying during the song. However, when I first listened to Debabrata Biswas’s version, I felt like — boss, we have been wrong all along! Later, when I listened to the words carefully, it felt like this song is exactly opposite to what it is made out to be. The person singing is not at all mourning. It is their friend who has been whining about the pangs of love. The person is asking — is it all this whining and mourning that drives people to fall in love? See the world around you which has a lot to see and admire — the moon, the flowers, the birds. If none of this works, come to me. I will sing all the happy songs I know, to fix your mood.
This is pretty normal. The way you feel about a song is always valid from your perspective. The problem lies with the Visvabharati Music Board. They will never tolerate multiple interpretations. They have a set “correct version” in mind and have even kept this exact wording on their website.
People even now have this expectation on Visvabharati that it is the only place for correct Rabindra-culture.
Debabrata Biswas mentioned how the people responsible for rejecting his recordings have never witnessed how Rabindranath’s songs were sung while Rabindranath was still alive. On the contrary, he himself had sung in front of Rabindranath even if it was only once. This feels like this is a matter of devotees fighting over what is left of the God’s offerings!
Mine! Mine!
Why did you touch with your dirty hands?
Amartya Sen in one his essays mentioned about how the image of Rabindranath was that of a superhuman mystic in the West for several years. It was only after their reading of Rabindranath’s later works that it all changed. This made we think about how we, the people of the East, still hold the superhuman image of Rabindranath close to our hearts, soaking in the alleged spirituality. We have successfully rejected almost all the rational ideas that he has written about. It is quite natural that we would not pay any heed to any type of rationality when it comes to his songs.
It is not only about Rabindranath. It should be a matter of discourse how Rabindranath and his contemporaries used to experiment with Rabindranath’s songs.
I came to know how the song “Tobu Mone Rekho” was recorded in three distinct styles by three members of the Thakurbari. Rabindranath’s version of this song is very different from the commonly sung version. What would happen if a board like this decrees that the commonly sung version is the only correct version? That would be shocking!
It would make Rabindranath, anti-Rabindranath!
Rabindrasangeet is nothing but covers! One day, if multiple people come forward and decide to cover fifty odd songs all in the same way? I would tell them not to cover at all!
Rabindranath himself used to teach his own songs in different notations. I have also come to know how Indira Debi, while singing or teaching Rabindranath’s songs, used to experiment with harmonies. This proves that there was never a strict rule book to follow. Satyajit Ray, while talking about Debabrata said, when we used to listen to George Da’s songs, it never occurred to us if correct notations were being followed. Why? Because the meaning and the spirit of the songs were always intact. He added that the versions of Rabindrasangeet that he was used to, from his childhood, came from only a handful of artists. Debabrata was the only one in his later life.
While we are finding all this fuss about notation not matching, it is interesting to think that there were no official notation book for several years. All that they had were few magazines where the notations were published randomly. So much chaos for so little documentation!
There is one incident involving the word “chonchol” in one of Rabindranath’s songs. An objection was raised on how the syllable “chon-” did not match the way it should have been sung as per the notation. Accordingly, a member from the music board directly arrived at Debabrata’s house to complain! That song was still recorded. Just as you mentioned about notations not being available for all the songs, there was once a rule that you can not record songs without notations.
We will find similar instances in the past. Once in an exhibition in Paris, a painting was rejected on the grounds that “one doesn’t paint a nude descending a staircase, that’s ridiculous… a nude should be respected”. The nude figure can be shown reclining in a majestic way looking dreamily at things but never involved in an arduous activity. All Duchamp did to get his painting rejected was to paint someone descending a staircase. However, about fifty to sixty years before this incident, in another exhibition in Paris, the Paris Salon, “all paintings they displayed followed a specific set of rules designed to imitate the work of Renaissance masters like Michelangelo and Titian.”. Manet created Olympia, a painting that broke all these conventions. But was it rejected? The painting was displayed at Paris Salon that year!
I get it but why will you keep such conventions in the first place? Is it really necessary for every single piece of art to be exactly according to your liking? When I heard the album version of “Prano Bhoriye Trisha Horiye” sung by Debabrata Biswas, I felt that the music used in the prelude, interlude and throughout the song did not match with the idea of the song. I disliked it. However when I heard the same song recorded by Debabrata Biswas for a live event on Doordarshan, I felt it was perfect!
I had a similar experience with “Tumi Robe Nirobe”. I have heard three to four versions sung by him. The particular version I like, is so good, I don’t feel like listening to the other versions.
That’s true. You can have a liking/disliking for things like painting or even music. However, Rabindrasangeet or the idea of Rabindranath is a matter of racial identity. All the respect that Bengalis have amassed over the years, now depends on Rabindranath’s songs. Is this a joke to you!
Yes, do whatever you like with your own songs. Why tug at Rabindranath at every single opportunity?
Exactly! That is what I mean. However, when I read about Debabrata Biswas’s childhood, I felt that things were a lot different then. Debarata Biswas mentioned how on one hand Rabindranath’s songs were sung in Brahmo households and on the other, the Hindu households would condemn Rabindranath’s songs. What he meant was that for a long period of time, Rabindranath’s songs were limited to high-society and Brahmo families. It was much later when Pankaj Mullick used Rabindranath’s songs in films that the songs started gaining popularity. Rabindranath’s songs “having music and lyrics that are so unique, should reach the listeners by themselves. That is not the reality. It’s only after being used in movies, that people listen.”
There is one more thing. The year of Rabindranath’s 100th birth anniversary saw numerous events being organized across the state which also contributed to the popularity of Rabindrasangeet. Now, Debabrata Biswas was that person who had seen this transition — from being used in films to being sung at the events on 100th birth anniversary. He being a Brahmo, had also witnessed how the songs that he had always known as Brahmosangeet from his childhood were now being labelled as Rabindrasangeet. A person who has seen this transformation was at a later stage informed by the music board — if you would like to record a Brahmosangeet album, please be very careful that the correct ambiance for Brahmosangeet is maintained. Such condescension!
Yes! Debabrata Biswas had to go through such wonderful experiences. In the end, he said in one of his recordings — I have recorded my views on the problems related to Rabindranath’s songs. Please let people know after I am gone. Now when I heard this statement, I felt that this can not be an act of justifying oneself. Rabindranath’s songs are not bound by copyrights but by the mania and the mentality surrounding them.
That they are! There is also a confusion. Haven’t we both listened to at least 20 odd Rabindrasangeet since childhood? Is it solely because of our refined taste in music or is it really a normal thing in a Bengali household?
Chandril had also mentioned in an interview on similar lines how it is like a stimulus — response cycle.
Yes, in blood donation camps, in fairs, during Pujas and even in weddings…
Yes, yes that wedding in particular… the one we both attended in Burdwan. Now it is normal to have loudspeakers and dancing during the ceremony. The kids hope in excitement…
Hope is not always enough. Specially if the case is so! The most important guest from the bride’s side happened to be a school principal. The idea was to play only serious songs while the principal sir was present. What is a “serious song”? Rabindrasangeet! It went on till 10:30 in the night. The kids were restless waiting for their choice of songs. It was only after the principal had left that they were able to play songs of their choice and have fun.
There was a time when in our city… Rabindranath’s songs used to play at traffic signals. Rabindrasangeet is also needed after election victory.
I read that after a few days, Rabindrasangeet is going to be played on garbage trucks as well! This news is from Howrah! Even on 26th January or 15th August, you will notice how the day would start by playing patriotic songs over the loudspeaker only to play Rabindrasangeet love songs by afternoon.
The idea that there can be no song before or after Rabindranath that is fit enough to be played, is plain vulgar. The need for playing Rabindranath’s songs at every public event comes from the need of faking dignity.
Irrespective of the need, if something is that over-exposed, isn’t irritation a normal reaction? Rabindrasangeet, again!
It is from this perspective that Debabrata Biswas’s interpretations become something fresh, something out of the ordinary.
Debabrata Biswas had once gone to sing “Bandh Bhenge Dao” from the play “Tasher Desh”. Before he went on stage, he asked the director if he can sing the song with pleasure or without pleasure. Will any director ever instruct to perform without pleasure? So, when the director asked to sing with pleasure, he sang with so much pleasure that the dancers started panicking. Now, by pleasure, he must have meant the way he used to sing for IPTA…
That is correct. However this man not only sang for IPTA but also during the famines or even during the Bangladesh war…
Yes, the circumstances were very different back then. Utpal Dutt had to spend several months in jail for his writing.
Talking about Calcutta 71, the director explained how “it was almost like the people buying tickets and going to attend a protest meeting.” Films like those are not being made. If they do, they won’t get released. After that you can decide about the type of protest you want.
It’s not even about the government. The entire society gets up in arms when they find an artist taking a political stand.
This is where Debabrata Biswas tells something different. He said that it is not feasible to change mindsets through songs. And if we think about this, has the mindset regarding songs or even music changed at all?
He created few songs on the problems of Rabindrasangeet and got them recorded but the recording company did not release them for years. These were not Rabindrasangeet that the music board would interfere. Still they did not. However, now we can find those songs. Perhaps the company had released…
Released them later. The time frame in which these events happened was also the same time frame when a person on the other side of the world, named Arunendu Das, was creating Bengali songs by interpreting contemporary English ones. His songs had traces of music and words by Tom Paxton but the resulting songs always sounded very original.
It’s the case with “Sonar Horin Chai” as well. When the words “She Je Chomke Beray” comes in the song, the way Debabrata Biswas sings them with his original expression, it feels like it’s his own song.
Joyjit Lahiri wrote a song which was then composed separately by Sayatya and Upal. The two resulting songs, although having the same words, ended up having two very different meanings.
Yes. For instance, I have heard at least four different interpretations of “Suzanne” in Bengali. For many years, I had considered “Se Jon” as the closest interpretation but after listening to “DaakBaksher Gaan”, I was convinced that it was the one!
Debabrata Biswas narrated an incident. A foreign composer was once playing their composition to a group of people. After they were done playing, most of their listeners showered praises on them — brilliant, super, fantastic. But one of the listeners, who was himself a composer, kept quiet. When he was asked by the others about his reaction, he replied — listening to the music, I felt like I was in a desert trapped in the middle of a fierce sand storm. With time, the storm slowly subsided only for the desert to be flooded with moonlight. The composer was ecstatic after hearing this. They said — exactly! I had tried to do this exact thing and so, the composition had been aptly named as “Caravan”. This made me think how the interpretations of the listeners also become important in music. In this case it matched with that of the creator but it might not match at all and that too is fine.
Yes, what if we can bring together the interpretations of a song by different people across different timelines? Genius.com which holds the interpretations of Bob Dylan’s songs today, can very well hold the interpretations of Rabindranath’s songs tomorrow!
But that would only happen when there will be a discourse on the words written by Rabindranath. When a young boy recites Gayathri mantra every day after receiving the janeyu, does he really care about the meaning of the mantra he is reciting? This is exactly the matter with Rabindranath’s songs. Suman, in an interview, said that Q had sung “Elem Notun Deshe” so badly, he should have been slapped and that we Bengalis are too liberal in this regard.
He himself had used music and themes from popular English songs and published albums with his interpreted songs. This is not even about legality but did anyone attest to the fact that his interpretations were in sync with the original work?
No. No. No. We are actually wrong in this regard. Rabindranath is above art. You can never do whatever who can with Rabindranath’s works. Q, who ended up making the film “Tasher Desh” only for interpreting the songs in the play, was not particularly happy when Suman on the other hand, started publishing albums on Rabindranath’s songs.
Interpreted works can at times even turn out to be better than the original. This is the story of a song. When the song was originally recorded, the recording company did not want to release it. Ultimately when the song was released from a smaller company, there was not much acceptance for the next 10 to 15 years. It was only Bob Dylan who used to include it in some of his live acts. It was only after Jeff Buckley covered the song that it started becoming the legend it is now. The situation is such that someone who has not listened to a single song by Cohen, would have at least listened to “Hallelujah”.
This is how it works. Understanding and liking Rabindranath’s songs without Debabrata Biswas’s interpretations would have been… impossible.
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